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Thread: SCSI Blacklists - or why some perfect images won't run with Daemon Tools v4

  1. #1

    Default SCSI Blacklists - or why some perfect images won't run with Daemon Tools v4

    Daemon Tools v4 doesn't work! (Or does it?)

    As almost every Daemon Tools user will have noticed by now, images of games protected with the latest versions of SafeDisc (v4.6), SecuROM (v7+) and StarForce (v3.5+) will not work with Daemon Tools v4 in most cases.

    Even if you are using a perfect image, one that cannot be distinguished from an original CD when it's mounted, you will probably still get an error like "Please insert the correct CD-ROM" or "Please insert the CD-ROM into another drive". But we (the Daemon Tools team) claimed to have fixed all blacklists with Daemon Tools v4? So what's going on?


    The explanation

    Well, no blacklist will recognize DTv4 anymore. And they probably won't for quite some time because DTv4 includes some really hard to break anti-blacklist measures. But the developers of StarForce (and subsequently SecuROM and SafeDisc) decided to blacklist all SCSI drives, at least if any optical IDE drives (that is CD & DVD drives) are found in the system.

    DTv4, like every other existing virtual drive, is SCSI-based. And as most people have optical IDE drives in their computers, Daemon Tools' virtual drives won't work anymore although they're not even recognized as such. By the way, those games won't run from SCSI CD-ROM drives either!

    So we did exactly as we claimed, we fixed all blacklists, and we support all existing copy protections, but still it won't work because of that SCSI blacklist.


    So what can you do to fix this?

    Until very recently all these SCSI blacklists could be fooled by hiding the optical IDE drives with tools like StarForce Nightmare. And there are other tools like SafeDisc 4 hider or SR7 burner loader that will let you run games with some of those protections, too. (This is not true for Windows XP x64, so far there are no such tools that run on that operating system.)

    But ultimately, those tools are temporary fixes, and I wouldn't count on them working for too long, after all, StarForce 3.5+ has already defeated those. And once that has happened, all you can do is switch off your computer and unplug your optical IDE drives. That way the requirement for SCSI blacklists - the presence of optical IDE drives - is not met anymore.


    The future

    The next main update to the customer version of DTv4 will be a virtual IDE drive. Protected against blacklisting with all the measures that are used on the SCSI version of DTv4, but immune to SCSI blacklists, it will once and for all make unplugging your drives a thing of the past.

    Furthermore, there will be a Daemon Tools IDE jammer for the free (SCSI) version of Daemon Tools that hides the optical IDE drives. It will basically do what StarForce Nightmare does, but with the anti-blacklisting features that are used on Daemon Tools.


    A special note for nForce 3/4 users

    The IDE controller that is used on nForce 3/4-based motherboards cannot be directly addressed by today's copy protections; as a result, SCSI blacklists don't work on those systems. If you are fortunate enough to have an nForce 3/4-based system, you should be able to run all the latest SafeDisc-, SecuROM- and StarForce-protected games with your IDE CD/DVD drives plugged in and working. Edit: This doesn't always seem to work, and sometimes it works only with some copy protections.
    "I was inappropriately blunt, wasn't I? Sorry, I do that a lot."

  2. #2
    Experienced User
    Methadon's Avatar
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    10.10.2005
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by NetSoerfer
    A special note for nForce 3/4 users

    The IDE controller that is used on nForce 3/4-based motherboards cannot be directly addressed by today's copy protections; as a result, SCSI blacklists don't work on those systems. If you are fortunate enough to have an nForce 3/4-based system, you should be able to run all the latest SafeDisc-, SecuROM- and StarForce-protected games with your IDE CD/DVD drives plugged in and working.
    Thanks for that explanation, I have been wondering how this could be.
    I wonder if the copy protections will put an and of that soon, hope not.

  3. #3
    Experienced User Nikos's Avatar
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    13.10.2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by Methadon
    Thanks for that explanation, I have been wondering how this could be.
    I wonder if the copy protections will put an and of that soon, hope not.
    They will.
    To contact me privately, pray. I might answer.

  4. #4

    Default First Post

    I just hope that before the copy protectors find out about the nforce3/nforce4 quirk that the ide jammer or daemon tools pro is released.

  5. #5

    Default

    hehe

    since iґve connected my IDE-Drives via Onboard RAID-Controller on my Abit AX 8 V2.0 any game with any protection works fine for me.... i just have to mount the images via using DT4

    regards,

    Hans

  6. #6

    Default

    @NetSoerfer

    Thank you for this detailed explanation.

    There is also a cheap and working solution to fool the copy protections: I connected all my optical drives to an external raid controller. So I can make an image with my Alcohol retail version (I'm glad that I purchased it in October 2002), mount the image in Daemon Tools 4 and start the game. This works very well without unpluging anything.

    PS:
    I registered DT4 few days ago because this excellent work deserves the money! Very good Job, DT-teram!

  7. #7

    Default re: SCSI Protection

    this works for me..

    if any wants a script (either vbscript or win32 app(framework 2.0) to do the follow let me know...

    okay you can by pass this by removing the following from the registery... dont worry every time you reboot it gets rebuilt.

    what I would do is rename it just incase


    [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\HARDWARE\DEVICEMAP\Scsi]

    if you rename this then all D-Tools Scsi drives are no longer being flagged by the copy protection.

    I have verified with some of the new games that have this protection.

    just remeber that the
    HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\HARDWARE\DEVICEMAP\
    gets rebuilt on a reboot so it will need to be renamed every time..

    [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\HARDWARE\DEVICEMAP\Scsi]

    also you could do it on any of the d-tools SCSI ports

    example

    [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\HARDWARE\DEVICEMAP\Scsi\Scsi Port 0\Scsi Bus 0]
    [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\HARDWARE\DEVICEMAP\Scsi\Scsi Port 1\Scsi Bus 0]
    [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\HARDWARE\DEVICEMAP\Scsi\Scsi Port 2\Scsi Bus 0]

    just remove the one that corresonds to the device that you mounted.


    this all worked for me.... but I belive this will be short termed method. I think some new copy protection will look at the scsi port its self.

  8. #8
    New User
    Join Date
    13.11.2005
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    1

    Default

    I'm using DT for logn, long time.
    I'm wondering is there is any tool that can hide DT v4 like DT v347?

  9. #9

    Default Intresting

    Quote Originally Posted by freibuis
    this works for me..

    if any wants a script (either vbscript or win32 app(framework 2.0) to do the follow let me know...

    okay you can by pass this by removing the following from the registery... dont worry every time you reboot it gets rebuilt.

    what I would do is rename it just incase


    [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\HARDWARE\DEVICEMAP\Scsi]

    if you rename this then all D-Tools Scsi drives are no longer being flagged by the copy protection.

    I have verified with some of the new games that have this protection.

    just remeber that the
    HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\HARDWARE\DEVICEMAP\
    gets rebuilt on a reboot so it will need to be renamed every time..

    [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\HARDWARE\DEVICEMAP\Scsi]

    also you could do it on any of the d-tools SCSI ports

    example

    [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\HARDWARE\DEVICEMAP\Scsi\Scsi Port 0\Scsi Bus 0]
    [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\HARDWARE\DEVICEMAP\Scsi\Scsi Port 1\Scsi Bus 0]
    [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\HARDWARE\DEVICEMAP\Scsi\Scsi Port 2\Scsi Bus 0]

    just remove the one that corresonds to the device that you mounted.


    this all worked for me.... but I belive this will be short termed method. I think some new copy protection will look at the scsi port its self.
    Intresting workaround will try this out myself - really only a stop gap until the ide jammer or vide is released.

  10. #10
    New User
    Join Date
    30.11.2005
    Posts
    1

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by NetSoerfer
    Daemon Tools v4 doesn't work! (Or does it?)

    A special note for nForce 3/4 users

    The IDE controller that is used on nForce 3/4-based motherboards cannot be directly addressed by today's copy protections; as a result, SCSI blacklists don't work on those systems. If you are fortunate enough to have an nForce 3/4-based system, you should be able to run all the latest SafeDisc-, SecuROM- and StarForce-protected games with your IDE CD/DVD drives plugged in and working.
    dt4 works fine for me and my brother, both having K8T800-based motherboards. neither of us needs sd4hide or anything (which wouldn't work anyway, as we both have x64 installed). can't explain why it works, though.

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