where is it ?

[BobJustBob]

Of course its ok to criticise us, DT, Yasu or whatever, as
long as good language, no personal insults or similar issues are
involved. Plain and simple.

OK, but when I ask something it's not criticism. Maybe you just generalized now and were not commenting on one of my posts.

In regards to the Y.A.S.U. delay. Prior to one year ago, the release schedule for Y.A.S.U. was something like a new version every few weeks or so. It was regular! Then the accident, holiday and other work delayed it for over a year. That is a very long time, especially considering it's past history. Surely it's OK to discuss this long delay without people here taking it as some sort of personal attack. Especially people that have nothing to do with Y.A.S.U. I understand Y.A.S.U. is free and all that jazz and that's OK - I love Y.A.S.U. as much as the next normal guy. And since YASU is now pretty much "useless" for any game released in the last six months that uses either SafeDisc of SecuROM and DT VD is also heavily blacklisted, I'm very disappointed. Not in the products, rather the situation. Understand that.
Also I think non English native people get upset when I say that the current Y.A.S.U. is "useless". But that's a normal word to describe that what was once a working tool is now not usable on current games, thus "useless". (Unless used for older games.) If you use a knife so much that it gets blunt, and you don't sharpen it, it too is useless for cutting. People here need to understand the difference between bad mouthing a product and simply pointing out real facts.

Also I never ask about release dates as such. Again, this too I think is misinterpreted by some people. Rather, when I notice, over time, that the usual time it takes for a program to be released has increased greatly from what it used to be, with no explanation I start asking questions. Because I'm curious. I notice the change and wonder why. I then see that nobody seems to discuss what has happened and so I ask. And please nobody reply with the usual:"But they don't have to tell us anything." I know that too. But it's not a bad thing to discuss such a situation. We shouldn't be afraid to talk. I mean why are there specific forums dedicated to Y.A.S.U. if not for this reason ? To create a community around these products.

[evlncrn8]

if you actually read what i said you'd have realised that the developer of yasu was in a car accident, a while ago and is busy, and has little time.... now, as i said before, this is a guy who in his free time develops and codes utilities used by the community.. who gets no payment for it...

as for it being useless, protection gets updated, tools become redundant, such is the way of progress, such is the way of software.. so while i understand what you're saying about yasu not being updated in a year, there are extenuating circumstances (as explained above) and ranting/raving/asking for a new version is definately not going to speed up its development...

the whole protection situation is a cat and mouse game, at times the cat is winning, other times the mouse is, and daemon tools is definately one piece of software that does update quickly (albeit, not now because of holidays)... so a simple solution for the time being would be to use the originals and take care of them until a new update (of yasu, or daemon tools or even both) comes along... patience is a virtue after all...

and as lob said, my comments are not a personal insult or attack on you... and im a native english speaker and didnt get upset about 'useless', curerom was also in a similar situation, yasu superceeded it.. its just progress, and developing software does take some time especially in daemon tools case which has very few rivals (the closest being alcohol and i dont think they're 'rivals' per se)... where multiple os'es, security, ease of use, developing vscsi and vide drivers side by side, making installers, monitoring and running forums...

oh and if you're such a fan of daemon tools, where's your customer tag?

[Underheaven]

I have to say I am happy starforce has been defeated (ie ubisoft). Thinking about this is much more fun that worrying about the more lightweight protections (but they have good anti-debugging/hooking). Imagine if we had to complain about starforce still.

[evlncrn8]

i thought ubisoft dropped starforce...

[Underheaven]

i thought ubisoft dropped starforce...

I tried to say this is why I was happy. Hehe. Imagine if you asked someone to make starforce loader/hooker. Looool. We'll wait years with no freeware authors making anything. BUT no need to think about or talk about starforce- this is the good news I was talking about.

[LocutusofBorg]

@BobjustBob: Sure I was generalizing, but it also was a DIRECT
answer to your OWN words , may I cite you:

So in your book, if something is free, then one must never criticize it - no matter what.?

So you know exactly what it was, criticizm. Nothing more or less, at least I understood it as such and the answer from
you implied exactly that. Now please stick to your statements.
Especially as I confirmed that we even LIKE critics, Im sure that
we would never be where we are now if noone had ever criticized us.
It is a process to mature the soft you're working on.

But I think that critic should be well-thought, not bad-mouthed and not use strong words. Thats what I said,
nothing more or less. It was not directed to you, otherwise
I had pointed that out. I'm not the guy who is known here
to duck and cover when I feel something goes wrong...

What is also not a good behaviour IMHO is to give others "lessons" how they have to work.
E.g., suggest someone "You had worked on it too long because
of this and that - but instead you had to...."
if this guy provide a free software.

The difference is simple: You pay - you have all rights to complain. You pay nothing, than I (I do so at least, I use
frequently free software, too and believe me, there is ALOT
lacking sometimes!) tend to not write sarcastic comments.
This is simple because if anyone create something he re-
ceive nothing or just donations for, it seems to be mostly
a matter of FUN - if I destroy this fun, be it I create trouble
for such guy, be it that I criticize too much, then in the end
it is possible that such guy / or girl - will stop development
at all. I saw it often in the past! Users requested the moon,
in the end the cycles got longer and longer - and than he
said "guys, it was a fine time, but everything good must
come to an end. All this code is way beyond what I thought
a hobby should be" and therefore development stopped.

Well, thats the way hobby goes sometimes.

While I can confirm that you did not used bad mouthing,
strong words etc. I think you write in a way that can take
away the fun from the developers to continue to work on
such things. I'm pretty sure that this was never your intention, so take my critics against your style to request
things the same way as your questions to syk0 were intended.
I hope you understand what I mean... After all I know that
your goal is to get a new version of Yasu / DT and not to
blame us or syk0, but from what I read so far, I understand
that a developer, reading such things, is upset a bit... and
your intention for sure is not to make developers angry

To make a long story short: I suggest that both sites should
calm down and both sides should respectfully discuss with
each other, as everything else will never lead to success.
You are fully right when you say "to discuss about this products here and create a community". But then it is not
helpfull to give lessons to the developers like (let me cite:
"Just wondering when a new version of ... will come out ? Maybe they concentrate too much on the additional stuff they added and they bit off more than they could chew ?!? Why is the beta taking so long ? Maybe just concentrate on xxxx"

Sure, it is nothing I(!) would delete or censor, this to make clear
that my vision of freedom of speech is still (hopefully) intact.
Im sure most will confirm this. However, it is (also IMHO) not
good "style", as it reads very, well, "provocative", but maybe
you are right and it is simple because some of us are not
native english - that could explain it. If its true and you didnt
meaned it in this way, then I suggest to take care of this
fact and write it such way that we get your point without
such (in our eyes) unneeded "additions to the description".
Even if we are too sensitive, keep in mind that you want
something from us, not the other way around

I hope we can continue now in peace finally, as all this
time wasted for such fruitless discussion is invested better
in other areas.

Oh, and btw: There will be soon updates! I hope that this
is something that will make most here also happy. We did not
forget about you!
But we are not robots and need some day-off from time to
time!

[BobJustBob]

OK, I wrote another long post and just deleted it before posting it. It was in part regarding the just released DT Lite that still hasn't fixed the blacklisting. So a new DT Lite is out and has not addressed the biggest concern for it's users - that of games mounted with it not working. What can I say about this matter ? Am I supposed to question why this is so ? Am I allowed to simply ask "When will a new DT Lite be released ?" One that fixes the blacklists of the last few months ? (Because for me, yesterday's version fixes nothing.) Am I allowed to personally think that since this DT Lite that was just released yesterday and didn't fix anything regarding games as far as I can tell, that the next DT Lite will be another 2-3 months ? Could there be a "hot fix" in the next few days ? Maybe. But then that doesn't make sense. These games have blacklisted DT Lite since the last version which was released months ago - so with a new DT Lite released just yesterday that still has not addressed these issues I can only wonder. DT Lite is going from a nice little useful mounting tool to an "Internet search module with ads and toolbar and such ever-growing add-ons" with an image mounting option as an afterthought. With this post too, no doubt you will see it as some sort of attack or suchlike. It's not at all.

[evlncrn8]

still dont see your customer tag... so in essence, to me, you're complaining / demanding a new version when you aren't willing to put your money where your mouth is to support the development team..

how many other pieces of software like daemon tools / alcohol are out there that even come close to emulating some copy protections, making images and so on?..

daemon tools releases always have the 'it will be out when its out' policy, that and there is a notice (which im guessing you didn't read) stating that some of the team are on holiday (which, i hope you can see.. can delay some releases)...

simple fact of the matter is, if you dont like dt, then stop using it and use the original disk and exe, ranting/raving/demanding a new version because game x,y,z doesn't work, when you aren't even a customer simply astounds me...

[BobJustBob]

Who says I'm not a customer ?
You really are flamebait aren't you ??
You say nothing of value in your posts except provocations.
Are you insane ?? Let's look at this again just for your benefit:

1.) Yesterday a new DT Lite was released.
2.) I simply mention that it has not fixed the last few month's worth of blacklists.
3.) You post nonsense about this like asking for "customer tags" as if that would make a difference.

Ranting ? Raving ? Demanding ?

So asking politely is all those adjectives you used ? Blimey.
Actually you are a fanboy. If anyone says anything remotely against DT you explode with verbal abuse.

[Blazkowicz]

evlncrn8 refers: no customer tag (you don't have one) -> no customer.

[mastermind]

Who says I'm not a customer ?
You really are flamebait aren't you ??
You say nothing of value in your posts except provocations.
Are you insane ?? Let's look at this again just for your benefit:

1.) Yesterday a new DT Lite was released.
2.) I simply mention that it has not fixed the last few month's worth of blacklists.
3.) You post nonsense about this like asking for "customer tags" as if that would make a difference.

Ranting ? Raving ? Demanding ?

So asking politely is all those adjectives you used ? Blimey.
Actually you are a fanboy. If anyone says anything remotely against DT you explode with verbal abuse.

You have said that your posts are not meant as insults or attacks against DT (you even said at one time that it was wrong to interpret your messages as criticism). I find this a bit inconsistent with what you have actually written. Earlier, you wrote the following:

DT Lite is going from a nice little useful mounting tool to an "Internet search module with ads and toolbar and such ever-growing add-ons" with an image mounting option as an afterthought.

Is this not an insult? I do understand that it is probably meant as figurative speaking (not meant completely literally), but it does imply that the development team's foremost concern has become the ad module and DAEMON Search feature, with the actual emulation features merely as an "added bonus". And in your last post you claim that you have "simply mentioned" that the latest blacklists were not fixed (not a very representative summary of the post in question).

Since I first noticed this thread several days ago, I have tried to read its posts objectively. But I too find your messages to be of a somewhat hostile attitude, and even though English is not my native language either, I feel quite familiar with its usage and "culture". It's not hard to understand that others have read you the same way. Furthermore, you must understand that this is a community forum, and it should not come as unexpected that loyal users defend DT when they feel it is being attacked.

You're disappointed that the latest blacklists were not fixed in the latest update to DT Lite - that's perfectly okay. We can all understand that, and you're not the only one waiting for this. However, this is the holiday season and they probably have lots of work to do. Use your original game discs in the meantime.

By the way: In my opinion, the primary function of Daemon Tools Lite is to emulate an optical drive - plain and simple. No matter how many blacklists are out there, DT still does what it's supposed to do. Circumventing blacklists is something they also seem to take seriously, but this is a continuous war that can never be won, and it would be wrong and unfair to consider DT's part in this battle as a primary function (or obligation) of DT.

[evlncrn8]

flamebait ? nope, i'm simply stating my opinion, being a developer of software myself (not daemon tools) i appreciate the huge amount of work involved in puting daemon tools together and i also listen to the end users..

your posts are argumentative and effectively non constructive, and are circling around and going nowhere.. and you've been far from polite, not just to myself but to others..

i have absolutely no doubts at all that a new version will fix the blacklists, and then the protection will be updated, perpetuating the cat and mouse game.

i do know this takes time as the dt developers need to find out how the blacklisting is done (by 3+ protections), which means tedious reverse engineering...

i think you really don't appreciate or understand the amount of work involved.. so perhaps you could try it for yourself, then maybe you'll see just how much work syk0 had to do for curerom / yasu etc, and how much work the daemon tools team have to do as well...

maybe doing the above will build some patience and understanding in your character