Windows10+DTPro6.1.0 - NO Securom Emulation?

[powerdrome]

Hello,
I used to run an application from my windows XP and through windows 8.1.
It is an English-Italian dictionary from Zanichelli called Ragazzini version 2003, on Cd-Rom.
I created an image as backup and in order to not carry the CD-rom with me around.
I used to mount it on a SCSI virtual device and activate Securom emulation with winXP and Win8.1.
It worked with no troubles

Now I installed Win10 and Daemon Tools Pro Advanced Edition 6.1.0.0484
Created the virtual SCSI device,
But i cannot see the advanced preferences to activate securom emulation,
Mounting and running my image does not work, the dictionary doesn't load.
SPTD is installed version 2.2

Now with windows 10 i can run it from the ORIGINAL cdrom, though, but i would like to run froma virtual device for faster execution and for backup purposes.

Anybody knows any solution?

Thanks

[Terramex]

Hallo, and welcome to the forums.
In this case you have to create a new MDS or MDX image of your original disc using the Old SecuROM datatype.
That one won't need "extra emulaion" as it holds all required copy protection information.

[powerdrome]

NOT working with Windows 10

Thanks for your help,
here is the link to a DropBox Folder with 3 different images:
1. Ragazzini2003.ISO is the image i have used since 10 years with winXP and win8.1, always worked with Daemon Tools and securom emulation.
2. RAG2003.mdx, just created with DaemonTools 6.1.0.0484, OLDsecurom Profile
3. RAG2003(2).mdx, , just created with DaemonTools 6.1.0.0484, NEWsecurom Profile (left default additional parameters)

Here is the link:
*removed*

PS: I’m running windows 10, my suspect is that there is something wrong with Securom emulation and Win10


Many thanks

[Terramex]

Even though i understand your approach, i'm sorry i had to remove your link to the full images
If someone wants to test the disc check in Windows 10 i've attached a Mini Image instead.
There's no installation so just run the Zan.exe main executable.

I had no problems with your Old SecuROM image in Windows 7 (XP SP3 compatibility mode, also in a DT device),
but no luck in Windows 10. It seems the Zan.exe process is shut down immediately.
Maybe a copy protection problem, maybe a Windows problem on my system.

What's the behaviour on your system ?
Any error message ?

P.S.: sorry for asking, but your original CD really works without issues ?
I'm asking because of this: http://forum.daemon-tools.cc/f26/mic...6-x-oss-36766/

EDIT: btw. ProtectionID says SecuROM (very old.. v3 or less)

[powerdrome]

Hello Terramex, sorry for the link and thanks for uploading a mini one (how does it work? the mini image?)

Anyway here is the behaviuor in my system:

Running from original CD--> OK
yes i was surprised too, reading the securom limitation in win10, here is the pic:
screenshot

Running from DaemonTools SCSI virtual device+image with orig cd inserted: OK

Running from DaemonTools SCSI virtual device+image withOUT orig cd inserted:
- first time it prompts: no disc found in E:, and closes
- second time no prompt error, but Zan.exe process closes

I also have a ProcessMonitor Log when not running:
ProcMon LOG

I also tried to connect the virtual device to my physical E: with Daemon Tools, no GO
I also tried to give virtual device letter E:, no GO

Terramex when i first installed daemon tools on winxp or win8.1, i got the same error
until I enabled advanced emulation,
so now with Win10 I have the feeling that advanced emulation is not active!

Is there a way to check it?

What is your test results? did it worked the *.iso on win10? and win7

Thanks for your help

[Terramex]

The Mini Image works just like the full one but is just for test purposes to see if the disc check is successful.


But i had to update the last one as some sectors were missing

However, i'll forward your issue.

P.S.: i have no problem in Windows 10 with New SecuROM (tested only v8.03.0012) - so it seems to be no general emulation problem

[SUPPORT1]

Hi,


Terramex gave you right option use Old SecuROM profile for grabbing. Going to check if there any grabbing problem with old SecuROM, but seems to me it is the particular case.

[DevX]

It is also possible, that your physical CDROM device is not capable of grabbing subchannel data. This functionality depends on device vendor and model.

[Terramex]

@Development
I've successfully tested his Old SecuROM profile MDX image in XP and 7 (SCSI & DT device) - only fails in Windows 10.

[powerdrome]

Thanks you all for the support!

My thoughts....
Terramex had the same problem with windows 10 and NOT previous windows versions... --> this excludes a hardware grabbing problem
Why my previuos *.ISO image that worked with DT emulation till windows 8.1, is not working with Win10? shouldn't Daemon Tools handle the same image with win8.1 AND win10 (maybe something in emultaion changed with new DT version?)

I've tried to grab with a trial alternative software (not mentioning the name...) an *.MDS OLDsecurom profile... it WORKS using that software mounting!!!
Other tests with this ALT software:
My old *.ISO is not working with this alt software
Mounting the *.MDX grabbed with DaemonT, does not work with this alt software

Now the strange part:
Mounting this NEW *.MDS on virtual DaemonTools device, it runs but it takes 60 seconds to load, while the other software do it immediately
If I run with the ALTernative software, while also mounted an image on virtual daemon tools device, it runs slow 60 seconds to load
If i unmount the virtual daemon tools device image, with the alternative software my dictionary runs OK fast.

This dictionary must have a double protection check: securom + cd check

The new Daemon tools with Windows 10 is not handling this correctly.

Hope this can help to find a solution, thanks again for the help

[DevX]

1) Do not make tests with both original CD inserted and virtual drive mounted. The same applies to two or more virtual drives containing same image in different products. This does not make any sense because Securom will just use the first drive it finds (normally the first drive letter) and will ignore other drives. So by doing this you only add confusion - always make sure that your dictionary is mounted by one device in system only.

2)To verify the old Securom behavior, i installed the first Neverwinter Nights game (unpatched V 1.10) from original images - it has old Securom protection with sub channel check (before 1.21 patch). It works fine in Windows 10 for me in DTPRO 7 (latest version, released recently). So this functionality is not broken in Windows 10 and works as expected if image is CORRECT (mds/mdx/ccd). ISO will not normally work, because it does not contain subchannels. That is why it requires Securom emulation option in Advanced settings. On Windows 10 these emulation options are not supported anymore and hence you must have correct image with subchannels.

3) We need to investigate, why DTPRO cannot create correct image from original CD for you. Maybe there is some bug in grabber with "Old Securom" profile. But it is strange, that it works in Windows 7 for Terramex.

[Terramex]

@Development
Does the Mini image in post #4 work on your Windows 10 (7/8) system ?
The source for it was Powerdrome's DT Pro Old SecuROM image.

btw. is there any other difference between old any very old SecROM besides the few defective sector(s) at the end ?

P.S.: as long as SPTD is installed the only emulation option active by default in Windows 10 is RMPS ?

[DevX]

1)
I have just found a bug in DT during dump of subchannel information - subchannel flag is simply not saved to final image. Sorry. We'll fix this in the next version. This explains now why that old Securom image (made in DT PRO) is not working, but the "competing" one is ok.
I did not test the mini image yet, but it seems not needed anymore because of this bug.

2)
As far as i know, there is not much difference between old Securoms versions, besides that defective sector at the and. I name it "tricky sector." It is usually located 4 sectors below LeadOut and Securom verifies its presence in case CDROM does not support reading subs properly.

3)
RMPS is not supported in Windows 10 anymore too. This includes all CD-R media emulations: RMPS, Hide-CDR, Safedisc, Securom. Laser lock.
These type of emulations were used in the past for CD-R/RW written media backups, when image could not be burnt correctly (1:1), hence additional emulations options were needed with the help of SPTD.
In Windows 10 all this stuff was dropped due to several reasons:
a) kernel architecture of Windows 10 has changed significantly with the focus to security, and hooking physical CDROM devices has become much more difficult and less safe;
b) almost nobody uses CD-R/RW media anymore to play or backup games, and it is much faster and easier to have 1:1 image of original on hard disk, especially if you take in account size of today's HDDs.

So we decided to make is simpler for the user and remove these options. If someone has a lot of such old CD-Rs, then it is best to recreate proper image from original and forget this "ancient" stuff. Or use older OS and DT version.
What concerns RMPS in theory it is possible to dump such CD-R as normal ISO, then convert it to 1:1 MDS/MDX - we may do it in the future in case of high demand.

[powerdrome]

Hello, I'm happy we found 1 culprit and hope that it will be addressed on future releases.

I also tried the new DT pro 7 trial version, I liked the new interface.
I installed it on a clean win10
Firstly I got on installation a security message from defender:
Program:Win32/Hadsruda!bit
It seems that a malware Hadsruba was included.
Anyway I didn't install the sptd this time, mounted a virtal DT device and my mdf image.

Now the dictionary (image made with other program) works but again it is very slow to load (60 seconds).

Tried to install the other "competing" software and it runs it very fast (3seconds).

My suspect is that disc soft bus service is handlng the loading badly.

Any suggestions on this? I'm really attached to Daemon Tools, that I use since 2003, and don't want to change.

Thanks a lot

[Terramex]

Now the dictionary (image made with other program) works but again it is very slow to load (60 seconds).

Same behaviour with all images when mounting in a DT device ?

Please download this tool: http://www.bustrace.com/downloads/devfilter.exe
Run it, highlight your optical drive on the left, then check upper/lower filters on the right.
Which filters are installed on your system ?